Prop 8 Pushback
I saw a video this morning showing the street demonstrations being conducted by people protesting the passage of Prop 8 in California. They were marching down Market St. in San Francisco and they interviewed one of the leaders of the march and he said that he was no longer “asking” for his rights, he was “demanding” them. Never mind that his fellow Californians had just decided that what he was asking for was not a right conferred on him by the Constitution. It was his “preference.”
They also interviewed a member of a Catholic organization that had helped to pass Prop 8 and he was commenting on the partnership that has grown between the Catholic Church and the LDS Church, in defense of pre-born life and traditional marriage. It is very encouraging to see people willing to take a stand on these important issues, despite the risks. As you may know, there have been threats made on the lives of LDS leaders in the effort to defend traditional marriage in CA. Some have had to have police protection around the clock as a result of the threats.
I am struck by the anti-democratic attitudes of some of the folks opposed to Prop 8. Give us want we want or we’ll go after you personally. They are willing to abide by a popular vote, but only if it goes their way. Grow up, kiddies. You lost in the “market place of ideas” and the people have spoken.
~~John Cronin~~
November 8th, 2008 at 11:54 am
If this fight continues and proposition 8 stands; I wonder if this will help close the gap between evangelicals and mormans? This is a very big story that is being publicized and discussed at a national level. As of right now it is the Mormans who get the credit for the success of Proposition 8.
If this does help close the gap then I can only imagine it helps Mitt’s chances in 2012. The morman issue might very well be a non-issue like the non-existant “Bradley Effect”.
Now I recognize that the fight for Prop 8 might not heal the divide. I can’t help but wonder if it is a start.
November 8th, 2008 at 12:04 pm
The prop. 8 aftermath has shown these “gay-rights” activists for what they really are: violent, dangerous radicals who care more about forcing an unwilling public to put its stamp of approval on their particuarly lifestyle choice than they do about Democracy.
November 8th, 2008 at 12:45 pm
SED Read the post by 2theP, it seems to be helping. In the end we all need to stand together on common ground for the good of society.
This is really ruffling the liberals feathers, thus making conservatives like Romney a big target.
I don’t know about the future of the party. The ‘it has to be one of us faction’ is very much against Romney.
November 8th, 2008 at 12:46 pm
David Frum on Rahm Emanuel: The man from Delta
http://network.nationalpost.com/np/blogs/fullcomment/archive/2008/11/07/david-frum-on-rahm-emanuel-the-man-from-delta.aspx
November 8th, 2008 at 1:27 pm
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/us_elections_2008/7717278.stm
November 8th, 2008 at 1:36 pm
Mark DeMoss, (Romney’s liaison with evangelicals) on the ONE OF US” topic:
“I’d like to see evangelicals look for competent, qualified candidates who share our values, whether or not they share our faith or theology. I believe it’s wrong to oppose a candidate because of his faith (Mitt Romney), and equally wrong to support a candidate primarily based on common faith (Mike Huckabee, Sarah Palin).
Along the campaign trail I met so many people, including pastors and religious leaders, who could tell me only that their choice for president was a “good Christian,” or “one of us.”
This, in my view, is a dangerously inadequate approach to choosing our highest leaders. We don’t choose people for any other positions using this test; why would we apply it to one of the most important positions on the planet?”
November 8th, 2008 at 2:50 pm
A funny thing:
Protesters are planning to go to the LDS Temple in Oakland on Sunday to protest Mormons helping to pass prop 8. The funny thing about this that those of you who are not Mormon may not know is that LDS temples are not open on Sunday, they are only open Tues - Sat. When they go to protest there will be no-one there to hear them. Shhhh. don’t tell them.
http://www.mormonsstoleourrights.com/rally
November 8th, 2008 at 3:01 pm
Catholics, Mormons defend backing same-sex marriage ban
CNNPolitics.com
Fri November 7, 2008
http://www.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/11/06/state.laws/index.html
LOS ANGELES, California (CNN) — The Roman Catholic Church and the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints insisted Thursday that their support for a proposition to ban same-sex marriage in California did not target any group.
“Proposition 8 is not against any group in our society. Its sole focus is on preserving God’s plan for people living upon this earth throughout time,” Cardinal Roger Mahony, archbishop of the Diocese of Los Angeles, said in a statement Thursday.
“The Catholic Church understands that there are people who choose to live together in relationships other than traditional marriage. All of their spiritual, pastoral and civil rights should be respected, together with their membership in the Church,” Mahony said.
The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, based in Salt Lake City, Utah, carried out a vigorous campaign to get the proposition passed. Many Mormons traveled to California and made phone calls to Californians to elicit their backing.
“It is important to understand that this issue for the Church has always been about the sacred and divine institution of marriage: a union between a man and a woman,” the church said in a statement.
“Allegations of bigotry or persecution made against the Church were and are simply wrong. The Church’s opposition to same-sex marriage neither constitutes nor condones any kind of hostility toward gays and lesbians,” the church said, noting that it does not object to rights for same-sex couples regarding hospitalization, medical care or probate matters.
Three groups have petitioned the California Supreme Court challenging the passage of Proposition 8, contending that the ballot initiative banning gay and lesbian marriages was “improperly used.”
The three groups are asking for an immediate stay or an injunction to prevent the initiative from taking effect.
They said “such radical changes” as outlawing gay marriage cannot be made by ballot initiative but must, “at a minimum, go through the state legislature first.”
The American Civil Liberties Union, Lambda Legal and the National Center for Lesbian Rights argued in papers filed with the high court that the ballot initiative process “was improperly used in an attempt to undo the constitution’s core commitment to equality for everyone.”
It did that “by eliminating a fundamental right from just one group: lesbian and gay Californians,” the groups said in a written statement.
The organizations filed the legal challenges on behalf of Equality California and six same-sex couples who did not marry before Tuesday’s election but would like to be able to marry now.
In a separate statement released Wednesday, the three groups stated their conviction, which is shared by California’s attorney general, that California must honor the marriages of the 18,000 lesbian and gay couples who have already married.
Supporters of the measure said they would defend it.
Andrew Pugno, an attorney for the coalition of religious and social conservative groups that sponsored the proposition, told The Associated Press that the court action is “an insult to California voters and an attack on the initiative process itself.”
Demonstrators took to the streets of Los Angeles on Wednesday and Thursday to vent their disappointment.
About 1,000 same-sex marriage supporters Thursday demonstrated outside a Mormon temple, bringing afternoon traffic on Santa Monica Boulevard to a halt, according to The Associated Press.
Hollywood Police Sgt. Don Lawrence said Thursday that on Wednesday four protesters were taken into custody for interfering with police business.
In Los Angeles County’s West Hollywood, a watch commander said there were three arrests Wednesday: one for drunkenness and two for disturbing the peace.
No injuries were reported.
Up to 1,000 protesters staged a half-hour sit-in outside CNN’s Los Angeles bureau on Sunset Boulevard. The demonstrators chanted and banged on the building’s glass doors but dispersed without incident.
Hundreds also gathered on the steps of San Francisco’s City Hall, according to an AP report. Some held candles and carried signs that read, “We all deserve the freedom to marry.”
Talk show host Ellen DeGeneres said she is “saddened beyond belief” over the proposed amendment.
DeGeneres, who wed actress Portia de Rossi in August, said in a statement Wednesday that she, “like millions of Americans, felt like we had taken a giant step toward equality” by electing Barack Obama as president.
DeGeneres said that with the passage of California’s Proposition 8, “we took a giant step away.”
Voters in Arizona and Florida also banned same-sex marriages in ballot initiatives Tuesday. Watch where ballot initiatives succeeded and failed »
In California, supporters of banning gay marriage cheered the measure’s success. iReport.com: Did you vote in favor of Proposition 8?
“This is a great day for marriage,” Ron Prentice, chairman of ProtectMarriage.com, said in a written statement. “The people of California stood up for traditional marriage and reclaimed this great institution.”
Los Angeles County Registrar Dean Logan said Wednesday that he was suspending the issuance of same-sex marriage licenses in accordance with state laws that say ballot initiatives come into force the day after they are passed.
But in San Francisco, the mayor said his government will continue issuing same-sex marriage licenses until he’s stopped.
November 8th, 2008 at 3:13 pm
Mormons don’t have church services on Sundays?
November 8th, 2008 at 4:36 pm
Hi Nate G!
I haven’t seen you here in quite some time. Where ya been??? As always, it is good to hear from you. I did not know they are planning to go to the Oakland Temple tomorrow…. that is too funny if they are expecting an audience; it will just be them and the ground squirrels to enjoy their protest. I hope they don’t try to vandalize the edifice though. That would be awful… the truly awful thing is that they are so misdirected…
We are kind of talking up another Utah committed luncheon, think you could come???
November 8th, 2008 at 9:37 pm
A poll for Republican nominee for 2012.
http://news.bostonherald.com/news/politics/general/view.bg?articleid=1130852
November 8th, 2008 at 10:05 pm
Yes Nate, last Sunday they protested at the Temple too. When I read about that I thought it was hilarious. They must have been thinking, “man, whatsup with these mormons? They don’t even go to worship on Sunday!”
Seriously though, this issue is already becoming a polarizing one in California, and in time it could become polarizing throughout the United States. I’m amazed at how disrespectful many of the protesting gays have become towards Christians and the democratic process. How ironic and hypocritical of them to harp on about hate crimes and the need for tolerance. The protesters have shown very little tolerance for those who think differently from them. We need to be careful not to fall to their level. I should go reread Elder Hale’s general conference talk, “Christian Courage.”
I read an interesting article about a guy named David Geffen-one of the wealthiest men in the U.S. and openly gay. He approached Obama four years ago after his speech at the Democratic convention. Geffen told him he should run for president and he would help him. With guys like Geffen behind Obama, it’s little wonder that the future president opposed Proposition 8. One can only wonder what Obama will do over the next four years in support of gay marriage.
November 9th, 2008 at 12:12 pm
Jon-
I like your comment regarding tolerance. Yes that is very ironic. Are you in CA.? I will look up the talk you mentioned by Elder Hales. This issue is not going away.
November 9th, 2008 at 3:30 pm
No, I’m not in California any more but I do have family out there.
November 9th, 2008 at 10:51 pm
Proposition 8 and the ProtectMarriage Coalition: Unity in Support of a Common Value; and A Question About The Future
by: Lowell Brown at 09:43 am, November 9, 2008
http://www.article6blog.com/
I’ve spent the last few days dealing with a sudden and severe attack of employment, but have watched with great interest the aftermath of Prop 8’s passage. John has chronicled much of that here on Article VI Blog. To me, two aspects of the matter seem most fascinating: The unity of the ProtectMarriage coalition in covering one another’s “backs;” and the beginning of a very important debate about where the country is going with the overarching issues associated with same-sex marriage.
Standing Together
I’ll start with the Catholics. On Nov. 7, Bishop William Weigand, head of the Roman Catholic Diocese of Sacramento, released a statement “in response to attacks on the Mormon Church for supporting California’s Proposition 8, defending the traditional definition of marriage.” (Notably, Bishop Weigand is the former Bishop of Salt Lake City.)
Catholics stand in solidarity with our Mormon brothers and sisters in support of traditional marriage—the union of one man and one woman—that has been the major building block of Western Civilization for millennia.
The ProtectMarriage coalition, which led the successful campaign to pass Proposition 8, was an historic alliance of people from every faith and ethnicity. LDS were included–but so were Catholics and Jews, Evangelicals and Orthodox, African-Americans and Latinos, Asians and Anglos.
Bigoted attacks on Mormons for the part they played in our coalition are shameful and ignore the reality that Mormon voters were only a small part of the groundswell that supported Proposition 8.
As the former bishop of the Diocese of Salt Lake City, I can attest to the fact that followers of the Mormon faith are a good and generous people with a long history of commitment to family and giving to community causes.
I personally decry the bigotry recently exhibited towards the members of the Church of the Latter Day Saints—coming from the opponents of Proposition 8, who ironically, have called those of us supporting traditional marriage intolerant.
I call upon the supporters of same-sex marriage to live by their own words—and to refrain from discrimination against religion and to exercise tolerance for those who differ from them. I call upon them to accept the will of the people of California in the passage of Proposition 8.”
I can tell you from first-hand experience that Bishop Weigand is right about the involvement of the Catholics. On Election Night I was chatting with Brian Brown (no relation). Brian, himself a Catholic, is the Executive Director of the National Organization for Marriage (NOM), which issued the “Thank a Mormon” e-mail John wrote about yesterday. He was effusive in his gratitude to The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints for its role in the Prop 8 battle. When I pointed out that Mormons had not really gotten involved until mid-summer 2008, Brian informed me that NOM and related Catholic organizations had been working on Proposition 8 for about a year, since well before the California Supreme Court decision in May. They were the ones who did the hard pick-and-shovel work of gathering signatures for the petition, raising the early money, and all the other hundreds of tasks necessary to mount a constitutional amendment initiative campaign in California.
I have less information about early Evangelical support for Prop 8, but I understand it was massive. Pastor Jim Garlow of Skyline Church in La Mesa, California was an early leader and a major fund-raiser. Anyone following Prop 8 knows this, and saw and heard Pastor Garlow on television and radio many times. In mid-September comments on the role of Mormons in the coalition, he said
“I would not, in all candor, have been meeting [Mormon leaders] or talking with them had it not been for” the marriage campaign. He said he had developed a “friendship” with the Mormons he met, although he feels the theological differences remain “unbridgeable.”But he noted how Roman Catholics and evangelical Protestants have formed tight bonds through their joint work against abortion, and he said a similar process might occur with Mormons.
I met Pastor Garlow once, just before he appeared on a Los Angeles television debate on Prop 8. He expressed then, and has repeatedly expressed since, his gratitude to other ProtectMarriage coalition members, especially the Mormons, and has pledged his tireless support to the Latter-day Saints against the attacks leveled against them by No On 8 supporters. We probably have not heard the last from Pastor Garlow about that.
November 10th, 2008 at 7:22 pm
They were protesting our stake conference here in Seattle on Sunday. How pointless, WA passed a marriage amendment years ago. They like to vilify us when we have perfectly logical non-hateful reason’s for not supporting their cause. It shows a lack of maturity on their part.
November 10th, 2008 at 7:38 pm
A minority’s rights should never be voted on by the majority, never. This is a civil rights issue period. We will look back on this in 10, 15 years and see how wrong and ignorant this vote was. This was nothing more than people voting on fear, ignorance and hate, not knowledge and acceptance. By the way, the mormon church funded this ballot initiative with massive amounts of money, you cant have your one husband or wife but my religion says I can have several? Give me a break.
November 10th, 2008 at 9:47 pm
Proposition 8 and the ProtectMarriage Coalition: Unity in Support of a Common Value; and A Question About The Future
by: Lowell Brown at 09:43 am, November 9, 2008
http://www.article6blog.com/
November 10th, 2008 at 9:50 pm
November 8th, 2008 at 3:01 pm
Catholics, Mormons defend backing same-sex marriage ban
CNNPolitics.com
Fri November 7, 2008
http://www.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/11/06/state.laws/index.html
LOS ANGELES, California (CNN) — The Roman Catholic Church and the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints insisted Thursday that their support for a proposition to ban same-sex marriage in California did not target any group.
“Proposition 8 is not against any group in our society. Its sole focus is on preserving God’s plan for people living upon this earth throughout time,” Cardinal Roger Mahony, archbishop of the Diocese of Los Angeles, said in a statement Thursday.
“The Catholic Church understands that there are people who choose to live together in relationships other than traditional marriage. All of their spiritual, pastoral and civil rights should be respected, together with their membership in the Church,” Mahony said.
The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, based in Salt Lake City, Utah, carried out a vigorous campaign to get the proposition passed. Many Mormons traveled to California and made phone calls to Californians to elicit their backing.
“It is important to understand that this issue for the Church has always been about the sacred and divine institution of marriage: a union between a man and a woman,” the church said in a statement.
“Allegations of bigotry or persecution made against the Church were and are simply wrong. The Church’s opposition to same-sex marriage neither constitutes nor condones any kind of hostility toward gays and lesbians,” the church said, noting that it does not object to rights for same-sex couples regarding hospitalization, medical care or probate matters.
November 10th, 2008 at 9:51 pm
November 8th, 2008 at 3:01 pm
Catholics, Mormons defend backing same-sex marriage ban
CNNPolitics.com
Fri November 7, 2008
http://www.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/11/06/state.laws/index.html
LOS ANGELES, California (CNN) — The Roman Catholic Church and the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints insisted Thursday that their support for a proposition to ban same-sex marriage in California did not target any group.
“Proposition 8 is not against any group in our society. Its sole focus is on preserving God’s plan for people living upon this earth throughout time,” Cardinal Roger Mahony, archbishop of the Diocese of Los Angeles, said in a statement Thursday.
November 10th, 2008 at 9:58 pm
When I post articles regarding same-S….E….X marriage, they “await moderation.” In the article below I have changed same-S…..E……X….. to the term “same-[same]” for the purpose of by-passing the filter on this site.
November 8th, 2008 at 3:01 pm
Catholics, Mormons defend backing same-[same]marriage ban
CNNPolitics.com
Fri November 7, 2008
http://www.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/11/06/state.laws/index.html
LOS ANGELES, California (CNN) — The Roman Catholic Church and the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints insisted Thursday that their support for a proposition to ban same-[same]marriage in California did not target any group.
“Proposition 8 is not against any group in our society. Its sole focus is on preserving God’s plan for people living upon this earth throughout time,” Cardinal Roger Mahony, archbishop of the Diocese of Los Angeles, said in a statement Thursday.
“The Catholic Church understands that there are people who choose to live together in relationships other than traditional marriage. All of their spiritual, pastoral and civil rights should be respected, together with their membership in the Church,” Mahony said.
The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, based in Salt Lake City, Utah, carried out a vigorous campaign to get the proposition passed. Many Mormons traveled to California and made phone calls to Californians to elicit their backing.
“It is important to understand that this issue for the Church has always been about the sacred and divine institution of marriage: a union between a man and a woman,” the church said in a statement.
“Allegations of bigotry or persecution made against the Church were and are simply wrong. The Church’s opposition to same-[same] marriage neither constitutes nor condones any kind of hostility toward gays and lesbians,” the church said, noting that it does not object
November 10th, 2008 at 10:01 pm
Johnny,
I don’t know who you are, but I only have one husband, and he has only one wife. And it was not just the LDS who donated money. (the members donated, not the church itself. No tithing monies were used). Other churches have worked on this as well. If it were just the LDS, this would have failed.
Get your facts straight.
November 10th, 2008 at 11:25 pm
Also, Latinos and Blacks tend to vote against gay marriage.
November 11th, 2008 at 9:00 am
Chris, I never said this discriminatory initiative was solely funded by the mormons but if you don’t call $17.67 million that was contributed by 59,000 Mormon families since August to groups like Yes on 8 significant, what is?
Chris, those are the facts.
November 11th, 2008 at 11:12 am
I contributed.
I also have a dear friend (who I used to be married to) who is gay. We’re still friends. He understands why I donated, and why when I lived in CA, I worked for the original plan.
November 12th, 2008 at 8:20 am
To the Mormons like Chris who bankrolled the bigotry, religious discrimination is awful, as long as it is happening to them. — even though religious discrimination drove them from Missouri and Illinois in the 1830’s
November 12th, 2008 at 8:50 am
And Johnny,
We LDS believe in a living prophet. I know he speaks to God, and speaks FOR God. When he says marriage should be protected, I consider the source of his knowledge.
November 12th, 2008 at 9:11 am
Chris protection? from another loving couple? really, protection from what?
November 12th, 2008 at 10:10 am
NOTE* I have posted 5 articles regarding Prop 8 since last Friday, Nov 7. They have been caught in the “filter” here and are awaiting moderation. I believe the term “same- s_ _” is the trigger. It’s fruitless to spell out the word with spaces; I’ve tried 3 times, unsuccessfully. I would use the term “gay marriage” but I’m posting direct quotes and don’t have the liberty to change text.
CNNPolitics.com
Fri November 7, 2008
http://www.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/11/06/state.laws/index.html
LOS ANGELES, California (CNN) — The Roman Catholic Church and the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints insisted Thursday that their support for a proposition to ban same-s_ _ marriage in California did not target any group.
“Proposition 8 is not against any group in our society. Its sole focus is on preserving God’s plan for people living upon this earth throughout time,” Cardinal Roger Mahony, archbishop of the Diocese of Los Angeles, said in a statement Thursday.
“The Catholic Church understands that there are people who choose to live together in relationships other than traditional marriage. All of their spiritual, pastoral and civil rights should be respected, together with their membership in the Church,” Mahony said.
The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, based in Salt Lake City, Utah, carried out a vigorous campaign to get the proposition passed. Many Mormons traveled to California and made phone calls to Californians to elicit their backing.
“It is important to understand that this issue for the Church has always been about the sacred and divine institution of marriage: a union between a man and a woman,” the church said in a statement.
“Allegations of bigotry or persecution made against the Church were and are simply wrong. The Church’s opposition to same-s_ _ marriage neither constitutes nor condones any kind of hostility toward gays and lesbians,” the church said, noting that it does not object to rights for same-s_ _ couples regarding hospitalization, medical care or probate matters.
“This is a great day for marriage,” Ron Prentice, chairman of ProtectMarriage.com, said in a written statement. “The people of California stood up for traditional marriage and reclaimed this great institution.”
November 12th, 2008 at 10:13 am
NOTE* I have posted 6 articles regarding Prop 8 since last Friday, Nov 7. They have been caught in the “filter” here and are awaiting moderation. I believe the term “same- _” is the trigger. It’s fruitless to spell out the word with spaces; I’ve tried 3 times, unsuccessfully. I would use the term “gay marriage” but I’m posting direct quotes and don’t have the liberty to change text.
CNNPolitics.com
Fri November 7, 2008
http://www.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/11/06/state.laws/index.html
November 12th, 2008 at 10:23 am
2 the P
Can you try to just post the links?
November 12th, 2008 at 10:25 am
http://www.myfoxla.com/myfox/MyFox/pages/sidebar_video.jsp?contentId=7811577&version=1&locale=EN-US
video on LA Temple / Tongans
November 12th, 2008 at 11:28 am
Tracey, here are some links (couldn’t include all of them due to the filter-hanging word):
http://www.protectmarriage.com/about
Conservative Christians lead push for Prop. 8
Matthai Kuruvila, Chronicle Religion Writer
Wednesday, October 15, 2008
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2008/10/15/MNNC13ELMC.DTL&type=politics
Video: Prop 8 Battle far from over (Mormons only church mentioned…)
http://abclocal.go.com/kabc/story?section=news/politics&id=6495050
Leaders of the successful Proposition 8 campaign say an unusual coalition of evangelical Christians, Mormons and Roman Catholics built a majority at the polls Tuesday by harnessing the organizational muscle of churches to a mainstream message about what schoolchildren might be taught about gay relationships if the ban failed.
“Everyone told me it could not be done, people do not care about this enough, you will be overwhelmed and you will lose,” said Maggie Gallagher, executive director of the National Organization for Marriage, a New Jersey group that provided seed money early this year to qualify the measure for the ballot.”
Campaign operatives attribute their success to the churches, which served as voter registration centers, phone banks and volunteer recruitment hubs.
Religious institutions also gave Proposition 8’s sponsors an avenue to a range of ethnic voters, including many Democrats, said Mat Staver, who heads the Florida-based Christian legal group Liberty Counsel.
Catholic and evangelical Hispanics and African-American Baptists stood alongside conservative white evangelicals in arguing for traditional marriage. Exit polls showed 70 percent of blacks supported the ban, a far higher percentage than any other race.
“This is an issue that … transcends political ideology, religious affiliations, races and time and history,” said Staver. “It brings people together who ordinarily wouldn’t be sitting at the same table together.
Perhaps the most crucial faith-based ingredient of the California campaign was the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. The Mormon Church was invited into the coalition by San Francisco’s Roman Catholic Archbishop George Neiderauer, who previously spent 11 years as bishop of the Catholic diocese of Utah.
November 12th, 2008 at 11:48 am
A great read…
Media Have a Proposition for Calif. Churches: You’re Bigots
by Brian Fitzpatrick
Tuesday, November 11, 2008
http://townhall.com/columnists/BrianFitzpatrick/2008/11/11/media_have_a_proposition_for_calif_churches_youre_bigots?page=2
Initial press reports last Wednesday and Thursday included statements by Prop. 8 supporters and the vital fact that a 70-30 majority of African-American voters pushed Prop. 8 over the top. By Friday, Nov. 7, however, news reports focused on “civil rights” street theater by fuming Prop. 8 protesters. The villains of the piece, Catholics, evangelical Protestants and especially Mormons, no longer were allowed to explain their views or even to defend themselves against ugly charges of bigotry. The pivotal support of black voters quickly dropped out of the story.
On Saturday, Nov. 9, the Los Angeles Times posted a story headlined “Anti-Prop. 8 protests spring up in California.” A photo showed angry protesters waving signs accusing Mormons of “hatred,” and proclaiming “I am a second class citizen.” The Times quoted several speakers at an anti-Prop. 8 rally, including a woman who called traditional marriage supporters “bigots, bigots, bigots.” Ignoring minimal standards of decency, not to mention journalist ethics, the Times gave Prop. 8 supporters no opportunity defend their honor.
A Nov. 10 AP/New York Times story, “In California, More Protests Over a Vote On Marriage,” focused on 1,000 protesters gathered Sunday outside Saddleback Church, the evangelical Protestant megachurch pastored by Rick Warren. The story described protesters as “advocates of equal rights for gay people.” A “volunteer” from the Human Rights Campaign, a gay pressure group, accused Saddleback of spreading “misinformation” and telling “obvious lies.”
November 12th, 2008 at 12:50 pm
To read complete articles, comments, and links go to: http://www.article6blog.com/
The ProtectMarriage/Proposition 8 Coalition: A Solidarity Report
by Lowell Brown at 07:24 am, November 11th 2008
John has been reaching out to the Evangelical community, asking about response to attacks on Mormons for their support of Proposition 8. While e-mailing with others today, he got the following unexpected response from Pastor Jim Garlow of Skyline Church in La Mesa, California. (Apparently someone, somewhere, forwarded John’s e-mail inquiries to Pastor Garlow.)
Thoughtyou might want to know some of what is happening re: defense of the LDS.
Iam hosting an event in which Catholics and Evangelicals are meeting with LDS officials so that we may affirm their role in the campaign and . . . discuss how to defend the LDS from the scurrilous attacks upon them, and the mob-like frenzy that is being stirred by those who cannot accept the will of the people on Prop 22 and Prop 8.
Secondly:Last Friday (November 7) I put out an email to 7,200 pastors on Friday - to speak boldly affirming the Mormons for their role, and to get their congregations to speak out in defense of the Mormons.
Thirdly:I was one of 4 persons signing a letter to the New York Times condemning their attack on the Mormons. On another note - I was on Dobson three times in last three weeks. He took pains to affirm the Mormons & their role [in Prop 8]. If I recall - he did it in either two of the three broadcasts - or possibly all three.
Blessings,
Jim Garlow
Look Out - They Are Getting Organized
by John Schroeder at 07:05 am, November 12th
I have assumed since the election last week that the protests in the wake of the passage of Proposition 8 would eventually run out of steam as the reality of the fact that the people of California spoke sunk in. To date, the protests have been relatively ad hoc affairs. But now they are getting organized. Which may also be a sign that the effort is slowing down as organization becomes necessary to keep it going. We’ll see tonight. But the protests are spreading throughout the nation.
November 12th, 2008 at 5:38 pm
This is great and says it all.
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/3036677/#27652443
November 13th, 2008 at 11:41 pm
This issue will not go away. As a nation I do not believe we are ready to change the definition of marriage. If we were to hold a nation wide vote are country would come out in favor of traditional marriage.
Regardless of religious teachings, I think society feels that is it is best for society if children are raised with a male influence(father) and a female infuence(mother).
November 14th, 2008 at 10:46 am
As a nation we have changed the definition twice, once to allow blacks to marry blacks and then again, when we as a nation allowed blacks to marry whites. If there was a vote by the people on whether to allow this to happen back then, it would have failed. The majority should never vote on the civil rights of a minority, the courts got it right again.
You also say you believe we are not ready, I’m very curious to know when do you think we will be ready
November 14th, 2008 at 7:39 pm
Tracey, I’m sorry, I failed to address your last point where you stated “Regardless of religious teachings, you think society feels that is it is best for society if children are raised with a male influence (father) and a female influence (mother).
So Tracey, by your words, not mine, sounds like you don’t approve of the marriage if a couple doesn’t choose or can’t have children, is that how you feel? Did you know that there are many straight couples that wed that fit into this category?
Marriage is not about having children Tracey, marriage is a legal state government document that protects two people who love and want to protect each other, a church ceremony is just that, it’s a ceremony.
You say regardless of religious beliefs, which I wish was the case, so, if it is the case, are you just prejudice?
November 14th, 2008 at 8:43 pm
Johnny, I really don’t know why your here with us. It is about having children. Yes, some choose not to have children. And some, like my husband and I, cannot have them. So, we ADOPTED!
You can go to CT and get married. Go forth and marry. I’m not stopping you. But in CA. We stopped you. Deal with it.
November 15th, 2008 at 8:31 am
Chris, I’m here as the voice of many who are against hate, prejudice and discrimination. I’m glad to hear you adopted, that’s a very humane thing to do but you’re not answering my question; those couples that do not have children shouldn’t be allowed to wed since marriage is about children?
I can also go to Massachusetts, Canada, Spain, the Netherlands or a few other great countries (or states) but I’m not and we are dealing with it, in the streets, in the courts, around the country and the world, discrimination is not tolerable as a mormon you should know what that feels like.
By the way, I am a straight father of a gay son, a son that was married to his partner of 17 years, I’m fighting to insure that he has the same protections as my wife and I have had for over 45 years, so you deal with it, you’re going to have to.
November 20th, 2008 at 1:39 pm
The LDS funding of the Prop 8 campaign is part of the church’s attempt to win the hearts and minds of mainstream and evangelical Christians. The sting that Mormons felt over the
anti-LDS sentiment expressed during the Romney campaign was a wake-up call to those who had been lulled into the sense that they were seen as equals among the religious right. Ironically, bigots are bigots. Evangelical Christians will no sooner accept Mormons as equals than they will accept gays as equal. They will, however, be happy to take your money.
December 10th, 2008 at 11:32 pm
I have read the United States Constitution and the California Constitution and nowhere can I find anything that gives anyone the right to marry another. The reason for that is simple - Marriage was not conceived by a Constitution, a legislative enactment, a judicial edict, a royal proclamation or a presidential decree .
Marriage existed before any of these man-made instruments came into being. In every civilization, in every nation and every belief system from the beginning of time, marriage was the procedure used to unite families, insure family property rights, protect the assembled rights of each family member and provide stability for future generations.
At no time in human history did marriage involve individuals of the same gender - it was always between men and women. Now, some seek to change this fundamental bedrock on which our culture is founded, Are we so much smarter than the countless generations that went before us?
Certainly, gay couples should have the same legal rights that other couples enjoy and that ability is provided through civil unions. Just don’t call it what it is not - a marriage. Incidentally, this is Romney’s popsition as well - Some say he flip-flopped but his position has been consitent - equal legal rights but no marriage.