I said you can live how you want to live (as a homosexual) does not mean that I think it’s o.k. for you to get married. Get it??? I knew guys that liked to go out and beat up gays on friday night for fun. I thought that was terrible and I felt sorry for you guys. I work with people that are gay and get along with them just fine. It doesn’t mean I endorse their lifestyle or support gay rights. You live the way you want to live but don’t ask me to stand idly by while you try to radically alter the fabric of our society by pushing gay marriage.

Your marriage does affect me. If legalized, it teaches my kids that the government endorses the right for people to go directly against God’s law (it’s pretty clear in the Bible-if you’ve heard of that book-and you claim to have some kind of belief in God).
But that’s not all. History has also shown (in Europe) that it’s not over once gays get the permission to marry. They then go out to silence all those that speak out against their “highly evolved” lifestyle. I read about a pastor who was being taken to court for speaking out against your lifestyle over his own pulpit.

An infertile couple still want to have kids Mark. BUT, how many couples get married not knowing they are infertile???? Cmon, THINK ABOUT IT!! Another extremely weak argument that has no basis.

And the best one of all. You say…
“You made the most insane comment here “if you love your cat or dog, why can’t you marry them? If you’re “in love” with your pet, you have serious problems”
Exactly my point!!!!! There are actually people out there that love their pets more than they do any human being. Some of them may not think its an insane idea. If someone just forty or fifty years ago talked publicly about gays getting married, they too would be considered insane and had “serious problems.” It just shows how degenerate this world is becoming. Evil is now good and good is now considered evil.

You chime in all you like but don’t expect to get a free pass for it. You are welcome to share your twisted thoughts and we will share ours.

Go ahead and fight for “injustice” until the day you die. And once you reach the other side, I’m sure you’ll FINALLY get it. God will set you straight because he ain’t married to no guy.

Well Jon, if you don’t think we haven’t evolved by miles since then, well, you’re worshiping the right religion.

Did you know Massachusetts the ONLY state allowing same-sex marriage has the LOWEST divorce rate in the country?

WOW same sex couples REALLY did a job on “traditional marriage” in the only state that doesn’t discriminate against people REALLY want to commit to one another – give me a break – your argument is weak!

As always my message continues to wait in moderation – it amazes me that this site doesn’t like “others” to chime in. hmmmm??

You say, “You will fight against any attempts in your state to legalize same sex marriage” I too will fight against bigotry, discrimination and injustice until the day I day die!

You ask, “If I have no desire to procreate then why (an earlier question which you say I did not attempt to answer) get married? Procreation is NOT the only reason to marry, as I pointed out earlier – in your thinking an unfertile couple should not get married. There are over 1000 legal protections for married couples THAT’S why many people get married.

You made the most insane comment here “if you love your cat or dog, why can’t you marry them? If you’re “in love” with your pet, you have serious problems – just you bringing that up shows your grasping.

Jon If you want to live your life on a book of fairytales so be it – but when you push your believes onto others and tell them how to live based on your man made fable, then you cross the line. Know this - religion is the root of all evil, that’s why we continue to have wars and innocent people die.

My God loves all, does not discriminate or puts fear into people, I’m sorry that you believe in one that does.

You certainly seem very passionate about your position and I have no intention of stopping you from living the way you want to live. But don’t ask me to support gay marriage based on your faulty logic. I don’t doubt your feelings for another of the same sex. That doesn’t make it right. I may be married and have feelings for another person other than my partner. Does that make it right for me to act on those feelings? There are some feelings/desires that we have that we are not meant to act on. It will only bring sorrow, guilt, anger and depression.

So, go along your way and take the path that you feel is right, but I must let you know that I will fight against any attempts in my state to legalize same sex marriage because it is diametrically opposed to God’s plan for us here on earth. Marriage is ordained of God for the purpose of creating families. If you have no desire to procreate then why (an earlier question which you did not attempt to answer) get married? Along your line of thinking, so marriage follows love…then what? If I love my cat or dog, why can’t I marry them? A ridiculous thought but so was gay marriage not too long ago.

You CANNOT equate race with gender. As I stated before, this is like comparing apples to potatoes. Your logic is skewed and simply does not work. We could discuss/argue the issue until the cows come home, I really doubt it will make any difference. I’m done with this issue. Good luck and may you find the happiness and peace that you think you will by taking this path.

Jon is not igorant, she’s far from that. Jon simply stated that if everyone partnered with the same sex then human race will not perpetuate which is absolutlely true. It does not say anything about whether an infertile couple should marry or not. I don’t see how you can get mixed up with that.

Mark, just because homosexualtiy are evolving in our society does not make it right. . You said you believe in God and that He wants the best for his children. What is the best for us? Is it to always get what we want or to do what He wants us to do? My experience is that God does love all of His children but for all I know, He is not indulgent and if we let Him, He will, assist us in making the choices which will ultimately be the best for us.

By the way, your statement above means that an infertile couple shouldn’t marry because they can’t procreate – your ignorance is truly amazing Jon, truly amazing.

The bottom line is: Why on earth do you want to get married? What’s the point? Is it for the tax breaks and other benefits? Is it to be equal with the “normal” people? What if everyone became like you and partnered with others of the same sex? Our race would cease to exist (and please don’t bring up invitro fertilization). Men are meant to be with women. Women with men. It’s the beginning of the end.

There is evidence out there (overseas) that once concessions are made for homosexuals, that they then turn around to persecute and prosecute those that don’t believe as they do. One pastor was named in a lawsuit for calling homosexuality a sin over the pulpit. It’s not just equality that many homosexuals want, it’s to put away all those that don’t agree with their lifestyle.

I truly believe that once you learn/accept that homosexuality is not a “behavior” but the way one was born, you will understand the injustice in not allowing same-sex couples to marry.

It wasn’t too long ago that “traditional marriage” did not include interracial marriage, how did we change that? we educated people - would you want to be one of those people in that camp years ago? Imagine being born a different color and not being able to marry who you loved – sad to say but some people still feel that way and discriminate against those couples today - pretty ignorant huh?

For those who feel same-sex marriage makes their marriage less, than those individuals have much bigger issues with their marriage.

Your marriage to your husband surely does not affect mine.

I love my husband with all my heart, cherish and would die for him, he feels the same way.

We have felt that way and been faithful to one another for 15 years - Isn’t that what we should be teaching our children – that true love should be respected and protected?

Please understand that I didn’t choose being gay just like you didn’t choose being straight.

I ask you to think about what I said and understand how hurtful it is when someone feels that I am less than them just because I was born different.

Just couple of things that I want to point out for you to think about. You said, “there is no question in my mind that he changed his view so he could run as a “true conservative.” While I can totally see that is possible as well as somewhat logical, I don’t think any one of us can know for sure what is in another person’s heart. You may do your heart some good by giving Romney the benefit of the doubt.

I too believe like David D, that God designs marriage to be an union between a man and a woman only. I try to not to judge others who have different beliefs. I’ll be honest with you about my fear though of same sex marriage and it may be offensive to you even though it is not my intent to offend. Because I believe in traditional families, I would like my children to grow up in a society where they receive the same message.
It is my fear that the sanctity of marriage as designed by God (according to my belief) will be less distinguishable should same sex marriage be legalized. I want my children to respect individuals but that doesn’t mean we condone all behaviors.

Thank you for your response and I agree, a politician is allowed to change his mind / view however when you change on such major issues as abortion, same-sex marriage, stem cell research, gun control and immigration you must question why..

It was those views he once had that made him electable in Massachusetts, There is no question in my mind that he changed his views so he could run as a “true” conservative. Now you and his other supporters must question, will he change again on the issues that you voted for him on?

Renna says winning 10% of the Republican Party in your governing state is huge – not so, if he was to go up for reelection in his own state he would need a much larger percentage of republicans to balance off this heavy democratic state, fact is, he was not a popular governor, even in his strong hold republican districts (see link below)

Christine, I thank you for understanding where I am coming from, as a women you too have felt discrimination I’m sure, and fortunately for you will never again have people voting on your civil rights, the same rights Romney wanted to strip from me and many happily married couples living here in Massachusetts.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_b1gisboJ6M&feature=related

Those are some pretty solid and powerful facts. I can definitely see why you may feel the way you feel. However, I assume you and I understand that life is a process of growth and change. Most things that we believe when we were teenagers are no longer in our belief system. We mature, we change and we grow up. I am not trying to make excuses for what you may see as Romney’s flip flop. What we need to understand that NO ONE is perfect. We all make mistakes. For me, however, I try to see if the polictican’s heart is in the right place or not by looking at the broad spectrum. Above all, I want to know what direction he is heading to. I watched Romney’s dealing with his fellowman, his speech and his accomplishments and I am very impressed.
I am sorry that you feel that his governoship has hurt you. I do however feel that there is a possiblity that you have assigned motives in Romney that may not be true. You say we have our blinders on. Could it be possible that you may have yours on also because you feel injured? Those are questions that only you can answer.

You say that gays should not be discriminated against but yet you’re against same-sex couples having the same rights and protections as heterosexual couples, I don’t understand what you’re afraid of?

Civil marriage rights for same-sex couples is an established law in Massachusetts and should remain so. We have the lowest divorce rate in the country to prove it hasn’t eroded traditional marriage and if anything, it shown that couples living in this state are happier – what’s wrong with that?

You also mention God, I believe in God too, he loves and wants the best for all his children, and he, the almighty, does not discriminate.

I think we may have seen a glimpse of this early in this election cycle. It seems Mitt started out trying to be all things to all people and finally, when it was a little too late, finally found himself and his message. I can’t deny that Romney hasn’t flipped on a few issues, but find me a politician that hasn’t (Obama for example) and I’ll show you a shallow politician and a record without substance.

Romney is a good man who wants to do what’s best for a country that he sees crumbling before his very eyes. The media has poked fun at him, saying he’s a guy that just stepped out of the 50’s, an “aw shucks” kind of guy. In many ways, it would be nice to go back to the fifties and have a do over. No, he’s far from perfect, and he can’t be all things to all people, but I think many of us realize that out of what we have out there, Romney is our best shot at really making a difference for this country and turning things around. I’m sorry you don’t see it this way.

Oh, by the way in Mass 10% is a HUGE deal

If you are married this will make it easier if not try to imagine you are.

How would you feel towards a person who tried with all his might to take marital rights (you already had) away from you and your spouse? Rights that would protect the other should something tragic happen. Rights that would allow the other to visit the hospital if an unfortunate situation were to happen. Rights that would allow the other to claim property that belonged to both of you without having the courts get involved.

Now image that this same man stated several years earlier that he would do everything in his power to insure equality for all. Also state that he was more liberal towards these issues than Ted Kennedy.

Now imagine you supported this man based on what he ran on then watch him change overnight because he saw an opportunity to run for higher office.

Honestly Jon how would you feel towards this man?

By the way, he only one the republican vote in Massachusetts by 10%, that’s nothing to brag about if you were the Governor.

I find it hard to believe that Romney would have won Mass easily if he had done anything other than a good job in that state. Sure, he can’t be all things to all people and may have supported legislation that didn’t work in your favor, but you make it sound like he, personally, went out of his way to destroy your family. All the same, you sure seem to have a chip on your shoulder and I would like to know why. I didn’t realize that comments were being screened so carefully and would like to know what specifically happened to you.

I have noticed that some pro-Romneyites treat his run for office like the second coming of the Messiah or something. I am sure this man has made mistakes and will continue to do so but I am also sure that, on the spectrum of politicians, while Hillary is all in it for herself, Romney is on the other end and wants to make a positive contribution to this country. I don’t think the guy is perfect but I’m willing to give him a shot over the other lame choices we have.

The facts that I and others have shared are true, many are quotes or statements made by Mr. Romney himself. I don’t know where you live SGS but here in Massachusetts many of us know the real Romney, we’ve lived with him for six years.

As for being harsh, I’ve never written anything untrue or false, nor is my fact filled post that awaits moderation filled with any mistruths or slander.

I am always up for a discussion, but it seems every time I try to post my facts the moderator seems to find a way to hold it up or never post it. So, let’s see if it gets posted.

When Romney made that statement about him not going to be McCain’s VP, it appears, at least to me, to be more about his feelings. The fact is he lost to McCain and I truly believe (I know you don’t) Romney is doing this for the country. I see this change not as a flip flop of position but as overcoming his personal feelings to do what he believes is the the right thing for the country. If he were a proud man, he would choose to have nothing anything to do with McCain. (that would be an easier path) He is also a smart man and is well aware of the fact of being labeled as a flip-flopper. Logically, if he were looking out for himself and his political future, or to save face., he will not make statements that he would be honored to be offered a VP position. He is beyond that. Unfortunately, his critics sees this as he will do and say anything to get elected. Of course he wants to be elected because he wants to be in a position to make a difference. But he is not doing this for selfish reasons. If you think he is, you do not know the man.

Say what you will about Governor Romney. Time will tell you what kind of man he is. This I have no doubt. He is not a perfect man, but he is a very. very good man.

P.S.
I do believe it is impossible to raise a beautiful family with loose morals. At least not according to my definition of beautiful family. the kind that the Romneys are. I have huge respect for anyone who can raise a successful family.

I do not know why his comment is still under moderation. Perhaps he has been flagged because he has been pretty harshy in the past. I am not associated with this site in any way, other than inserting comment there and here. I have been here for almost a year now, so I am just sharing with you what’s up with Mark. It’s sad he does not want to have an open and honest discussion, which many of us have attempted to have with him many times.

Mitt did not leave my family alone and allow us to live in love and peace, so why should I be so kind to him?

My post is still waiting moderation, once it is up, you will see I do present facts, facts that hopefully will open your eyes to a man that will say, do, and walk over anyone just to get elected.

You don’t present the facts, you drop one liners with nothing to back it up and then disappear until you come trolling again. An intelligent comment has an opinion and some reasoning behind it. You make personal attacks without any substantial support.

You go off about Romney bashing McCain and then accepting a VP spot. Romney did not bash McCain anything like McCain bashed Romney. While Romney did compare and contrasts, McCain outright LIED about Romney’s positions, cheated in West Virginia, used robo calls and last minute endorsements to help him win Florida and California. If Romney did this you and your cronies would be screaming bloody murder. Of course they bash each other because they’re battling for the nomination. It’s all part of the political game. Get over it.

I was just presenting a man with now obviously questionable morals, despite his family that seems solid and reflective of traditional values (not to mention his public career up until this week).

As an aside, let me take you back to this quote in February: “I’m not going to be any vice president to John McCain either, that’s not going to happen.” Usually Mitt takes at least a year to make a 180 on his positions: this is a new record!

I made a post with some facts but it’s waiting moderation.

Mark

Mitt on Abortion

“I will preserve and protect a woman’s right to choose and am devoted and dedicated to honoring my word in that regard.”Boston Herald Debate, 10/29/02

“Roe v. Wade continues to work its destructive logic throughout our society This can’t continue.”Speech to the Massachusetts Citizens For Life Mother’s Day Pioneer Valley Dinner, 5/10/07

Mitt on the Amendment to ban gay marriage

“Mitt does not support it…As far as Mitt is concerned, it goes farther than current law, and therefore it’s unnecessary.”Romney spokesman, Boston Globe, 3/22/02

“When I was Governor, we took every conceivable step within the law to stop, block or slow down this unprecedented court decision.”Speech to National Right to Life Convention, 6/15/07

Mitt on Immigration reform

“With these 11 million people [here illegally], let’s have them registered, know who they are….those that are here paying taxes and not taking government benefits should begin a process towards application for citizenship.”Lowell Sun, 3/30/06

“One simple rule: no amnesty.If that [Kennedy-McCain bill] is not a form of amnesty, I don’t know what is.”New York Times, 6/4/07

Mitt onAdoption non-discrimination

Governor Mitt Romney and a legislative leader yesterday delivered unwelcome news to the Catholic bishops of Massachusetts, who plan to seek permission from the state to exclude gay and lesbian parents from adopting children through its social service agencies. The governor said he was not authorized to give such an exemption…Boston Globe, 2/17/06

“And then another slide along the slippery slope. The Catholic Church was forced to end its adoption service, which was crucial in helping the state find homes for some of our most difficult to place children… Now, even religious freedom was being trumped by the new-found ‘right’ of gay marriage.”Speech to National Right to Life Convention, 6/15/07

Mitt onStem cell research

[Romney]endorsed embryonic stem cell research, saying the controversial science might one day help treat his wife’s multiple sclerosis….”I am in favor of stem cell research. I will work and fight for stem cell research. I’d be happy to talk to [President Bush] about this, though I don’t know if I could budge him an inch.”Boston Globe, 6/14/02

“FACT: Governor Romney Opposes Using Taxpayer Money to Fund Embryo-Destructive Research.”MittRomney.com A Record of Protecting Life

Like I said, he will say and do anything to get elected to higher office, becareful Christine that smile and good looking family of his is not what they appear.

I only present the facts, if you and many that post here want to live in “the land of make believe” that’s your business.

I feel it is my duty when I see injustice and people are being led down the wrong path to speak-up….. the kool-aid you’re drinking is tainted people, wake-up!

You want the facts why he is not right to serve the people? I have plenty but you need to listen and take the blinders off first.

A man that tries to squash civil rights has NO principle!

I can never forgive a man that has torn many families, friends and neighbors apart in Massachusetts only because he wanted to appeal as a “true” conservative to his party, ANYONE who does that is SICK! – If your principles are the same, then may God bless you!

It is unfortunately, because if McCain is half a man that Romney is, he will have him on his final 3 to 5 list, but he is not.

Either McCain will suck it up or he won’t. If he doesn’t, it’s back to Arizona where he came from. It is as simple as that.

NO MITT……….NO MONEY……….NO SUPPORT.

I know it is hard not to become cynical and skeptical with our politicians. I am confident the Romneys are salt of the earth folks who truly try to live upright lives and their countenance, demeanor and speech shows, if you know what I mean.

There is no critical thinking involved in your argument that Romney does not have a lovely family because of Spitzer’s scandal. You should be more informed before you come on his site. I will try to appeal to your common sense but I just don’t think you are here to be part of the solution.

I wonder why some people come to sites like this just to pick a fight. I don’t get it. Mitt is a really really good man. I would happily work for him again.